Celebrating July 4th
wilkyjr printable version print page     Bookmark and Share
Wed Jul 01, 2015 at 03:07:11 PM EST
A decade or so ago I was vacationing in Hot Springs,  Arkansas.  It was July 4th and I attended the First Baptist Church in the city.   The bulletin for the church stated the message would be a patriotic sermon about the nation.  I braced myself for what I feared would be some misguided attempt by clergy to mix the worship of God with the idolizing of the state.  I was pleasantly surprised.  The sermon dealt with religious liberty and how the nation was not founded by making the nation an official Christian enterprise, but the great American contribution to the world was the concept of separation of church and state.
  I have found these pleasant and historically accurate church services are becoming more rare.  Our own region had the current Lieutenant Governor telling his Baptist audience in the church service there was no such thing as separation of church and state.  If one takes a summer journey to Branson, Missouri you are likely to find old seventies crooners booking audiences with hits from yesterday.  You will also find many Mormon family groups who more than likely make fun of the President and sing songs stating, regarding the church and state, "There is no separation."
     I have noted that it is now more common to honor veterans in churches with flag waving services at this time of the year.  What once was a parade, has moved into the church.  I have met a few pastors who decided to take the American flag out of the auditorium.  Such an effort will likely be met with more than a few expressions of anger.  
     I listened to the David Barton speech so many times I can almost tell you what is coming next.  Barton's media presentation has Washington, Jefferson, and Franklin rivaling the piety of John Calvin, hosting more prayer meetings than Jonathan Edwards and teaching more Bible studies than Charles Spurgeon!
     In the midst of all the flag waving and longing for a more piety in the nation, we have forgotten one simple, yet startling fact.  Most American Christians, who render such a fervor for the faith of the founding fathers, would not be willing to have anything to do with their Massachusetts congregations.  John Barry has written an intriguing book named, Roger Williams and the Creation of the American Soul.  The focus of the work is to describe the life of Roger Williams, the founding father who fashioned the American concept of liberty of the soul and conscious.  
     Barry wrote that Williams was persecuted by the early colony churches and even banished for his views.  One of his points of difference with the early settlers was the rights of Indians to own land.  The Puritans saw this as heresy and the Indians were nothing more than Old Testament Amalekites and they were the New Jerusalem.  
     This early American version of the church merged with the magistrate to control and define reality.  Unmarried men and women could not live alone, they had to board with a family or face discipline. Pg. 170   One man was excommunicated from the church for marrying a vain and proud woman.   Pg.  173  Roger Williams faced loss of home and career as well as church membership.  If he went back to England he faced being whipped, having his ears cut off and tongue bored.  He no doubt would have stayed in prison for the rest of his life.  Pg. 207  It was little better in New England with church and state merging to forge the official law of the land.  The church punished people by torture, (which was not waterboarding by the way.)  Some of the government officials wanted to kill Williams.  Pg. 209   An official law was established allowing capital punishment to be enforced on any who refused to attend church services.  In one of the Indian wars over 200 Pequots Indians surrendered after they lost a battle.  The Indians were than slaughtered and their wives and children sold as slaves.  Pg. 240  Adultery and blasphemy were both punishable by death.  Pg. 260  The church even enacted a law that demanded that every citizen rise at the same time each morning, an hour before day break.  Pg. 261
     Would we want a congregation where a small child came weeping before the church because her father was just slain because he did not attend church?  What layman would want to belong to a body who slaughtered hundreds of surrendering enemies and sold their family as slaves?  Obviously church members would come forward horrified at such practices and demand something be done to those who practiced such barbaric acts.  
     The Massachusetts early colony churches obviously gave way to a new vision.  This was the vision of Roger Williams and he laid the ground work for the First Amendment.  It was his vision that made July 4th what it is supposed to be.  He knew that all freedoms begin with religious freedom.    He stood alone and was banished by the Salem church.  He was left to himself, with no friends but the Indians.  He almost paid with his life.  He lost land, family, and endured the stress of being ostracized from his people.  He paid dearly for his vision.  It is his vision we celebrate, not ones who sought to mix the magistrate with the clergy.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          



Display:
Houston's own, the late R. B. Thieme, preached in a military uniform.  The church corridor was filled with photos of men in uniform, it appears many had little if anything to do with the Christian faith.  
He walked around with body guards.  He would threaten to fight people from the pulpit.  He would often tell the congregation that if anyone was there without their Bible they could get their ass out.
He was an early leader in the end of times movement we now have today.  His tapes were heard by millions across America.  Few knew of his antics.

by wilkyjr on Wed Jul 01, 2015 at 03:12:12 PM EST
Yes. You are right. Today everyone is trying to show that their religion was the first on earth and they are the one and only people in the world who are living properly. cbd benefits But actually, they were all trying to spoil everything here.

by MariyaDorothy on Fri Oct 30, 2020 at 07:19:18 AM EST
Parent



WWW Talk To Action


Cognitive Dissonance & Dominionism Denial
There is new research on why people are averse to hearing or learning about the views of ideological opponents. Based on evaluation of five......
By Frederick Clarkson (375 comments)
Will the Air Force Do Anything To Rein In Its Dynamic Duo of Gay-Bashing, Misogynistic Bloggers?
"I always get nervous when I see female pastors/chaplains. Here is why everyone should as well: "First, women are not called to be pastors,......
By Chris Rodda (203 comments)
The Legacy of Big Oil
The media is ablaze with the upcoming publication of David Grann's book, Killers of the Flower Moon. The shocking non fiction account of the......
By wilkyjr (111 comments)
Gimme That Old Time Dominionism Denial
Over the years, I have written a great deal here and in other venues about the explicitly theocratic movement called dominionism -- which has......
By Frederick Clarkson (101 comments)
History Advisor to Members of Congress Completely Twists Jefferson's Words to Support Muslim Ban
Pseudo-historian David Barton, best known for his misquoting of our country's founders to promote the notion that America was founded as a Christian nation,......
By Chris Rodda (113 comments)
"Christian Fighter Pilot" Calls First Lesbian Air Force Academy Commandant a Liar
In a new post on his "Christian Fighter Pilot" blog titled "BGen Kristin Goodwin and the USAFA Honor Code," Air Force Lieutenant Colonel Jonathan......
By Chris Rodda (144 comments)
Catholic Right Leader Unapologetic about Call for 'Death to Liberal Professors' -- UPDATED
Today, Donald Trump appointed C-FAM Executive Vice President Lisa Correnti to the US Delegation To UN Commission On Status Of Women. (C-FAM is a......
By Frederick Clarkson (126 comments)
Controlling Information
     Yesterday I listened to Russ Limbaugh.  Rush advised listeners it would be best that they not listen to CNN,MSNBC, ABC, CBS and......
By wilkyjr (118 comments)
Is Bannon Fifth-Columning the Pope?
In December 2016 I wrote about how White House chief strategist Steve Bannon, who likes to flash his Catholic credentials when it comes to......
By Frank Cocozzelli (251 comments)
Ross Douthat's Hackery on the Seemingly Incongruous Alliance of Bannon & Burke
Conservative Catholic writer Ross Douthat has dissembled again. This time, in a February 15, 2017 New York Times op-ed titled The Trump Era's Catholic......
By Frank Cocozzelli (65 comments)
`So-Called Patriots' Attack The Rule Of Law
Every so often, right-wing commentator Pat Buchanan lurches out of the far-right fever swamp where he has resided for the past 50 years to......
By Rob Boston (161 comments)
Bad Faith from Focus on the Family
Here is one from the archives, Feb 12, 2011, that serves as a reminder of how deeply disingenuous people can be. Appeals to seek......
By Frederick Clarkson (177 comments)
The Legacy of George Wallace
"One need not accept any of those views to agree that they had appealed to real concerns of real people, not to mindless, unreasoning......
By wilkyjr (70 comments)
Betsy DeVos's Mudsill View of Public Education
My Talk to Action colleague Rachel Tabachnick has been doing yeoman's work in explaining Betsy DeVos's long-term strategy for decimating universal public education. If......
By Frank Cocozzelli (80 comments)
Prince and DeVos Families at Intersection of Radical Free Market Privatizers and Religious Right
This post from 2011 surfaces important information about President-Elect Trump's nominee for Secretary of Education, Betsy DeVos. -- FC Erik Prince, Brother of Betsy......
By Rachel Tabachnick (218 comments)

Respect for Others? or Political Correctness?
The term "political correctness" as used by Conservatives and Republicans has often puzzled me: what exactly do they mean by it? After reading Chip Berlin's piece here-- http://www.talk2action.org/story/2016/7/21/04356/9417 I thought about what he explained......
MTOLincoln (253 comments)
Fear
What I'm feeling now is fear.  I swear that it seems my nightmares are coming true with this new "president".  I'm also frustrated because so many people are not connecting all the dots! I've......
ArchaeoBob (109 comments)
"America - love it or LEAVE!"
I've been hearing that and similar sentiments fairly frequently in the last few days - far FAR more often than ever before.  Hearing about "consequences for burning the flag (actions) from Trump is chilling!......
ArchaeoBob (216 comments)
"Faked!" Meme
Keep your eyes and ears open for a possible move to try to discredit the people openly opposing Trump and the bigots, especially people who have experienced terrorism from the "Right"  (Christian Terrorism is......
ArchaeoBob (166 comments)
More aggressive proselytizing
My wife told me today of an experience she had this last week, where she was proselytized by a McDonald's employee while in the store. ......
ArchaeoBob (164 comments)
See if you recognize names on this list
This comes from the local newspaper, which was conservative before and took a hard right turn after it was sold. Hint: Sarah Palin's name is on it!  (It's also connected to Trump.) ......
ArchaeoBob (169 comments)
Unions: A Labor Day Discussion
This is a revision of an article which I posted on my personal board and also on Dailykos. I had an interesting discussion on a discussion board concerning Unions. I tried to piece it......
Xulon (180 comments)
Extremely obnoxious protesters at WitchsFest NYC: connected to NAR?
In July of this year, some extremely loud, obnoxious Christian-identified protesters showed up at WitchsFest, an annual Pagan street fair here in NYC.  Here's an account of the protest by Pagan writer Heather Greene......
Diane Vera (130 comments)
Capitalism and the Attack on the Imago Dei
I joined this site today, having been linked here by Crooksandliars' Blog Roundup. I thought I'd put up something I put up previously on my Wordpress blog and also at the DailyKos. As will......
Xulon (331 comments)
History of attitudes towards poverty and the churches.
Jesus is said to have stated that "The Poor will always be with you" and some Christians have used that to refuse to try to help the poor, because "they will always be with......
ArchaeoBob (149 comments)
Alternate economy medical treatment
Dogemperor wrote several times about the alternate economy structure that dominionists have built.  Well, it's actually made the news.  Pretty good article, although it doesn't get into how bad people could be (have been)......
ArchaeoBob (90 comments)
Evidence violence is more common than believed
Think I've been making things up about experiencing Christian Terrorism or exaggerating, or that it was an isolated incident?  I suggest you read this article (linked below in body), which is about our great......
ArchaeoBob (214 comments)

More Diaries...




All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective companies. Comments, posts, stories, and all other content are owned by the authors. Everything else © 2005 Talk to Action, LLC.